The Consolidation – Disaggregation Cycle

A recurring dynamic within the ongoing technological revolution is the process in which the forces of centralization sweep up the various nodes within a particular area into a dominant organization or industry. Centralization follows the initial success of some new technology or use of a technology. Once a set of dominant players control a market, the forces of decentralization kick in and pick away at it. It is like the expanding and contracting of the universe.

In the early days of computing, you had big machines maintained by an army of engineers at special facilities. As more computers were created, the next step was to network them into the first distributed network. What followed was the age of the mainframe and midframe, which centralized all the users of an organization into one main computer, which they accessed via terminals. The original internet was a consolidation of these machines.

The PC started to nibble away at this structure. Instead of the user storing all his data on the central machine, he kept it on his local machine. He shared his data with others by copying it onto a disk and then walking it over to that user using what was eventually called sneaker-net. Soon, the local area network allowed the office to share resources and disconnect from the mainframe. The internet then allowed those offices to share data with one another in a distributed network.

Of course, the forces of centralization roared back as servers came to dominate the office network and then the organizational network. As quick as everyone had a personal computer, they were soon forced to make it fully accessible to the impersonal network and then make it little more than a terminal attached to the organization’s network of servers. This soon led to the return of the mainframe era, which was pleasantly renamed cloud computing.

This consolidation – disaggregation cycle is a pretty good model for the history of human civilization, so it makes sense that it plays out in technology. In the disaggregated world, there are those who see a benefit, personally, morally or philosophically in bringing the disparate parts under one roof. At some point in the consolidation process, there are those who begin to see a benefit, personally, morally or philosophically in breaking the blob into pieces or creating alternative pieces to the blob.

A good model for this is the internet community. The first “social media” was the BBS created in the early days of computing. The Bulletin Board System was modeled after the old-fashioned bulletin board. The main difference was that when someone posted something, others could post replies and then others could reply to those replies for as long as the topic required replies. Sites like 4chan are pretty much just the old BBS with a cheap graphical interface.

The problem with the BBS was that it did not take long before the topics grew too diverse to organize, and the users started to hate one another. Soon groups of users started to spin up new boards for their specific topic or to get away from a rival fraction they used to war with on the old board. The central board broke into a million bespoke boards organized around the tribal instincts of their users. It is not hard to see how humans spread around the globe once you understand this.

What we now call social media has been defined by the consolidation – disaggregation cycle that is the nature of humanity. Just as the centralized BBS splintered into many small communities, subsequent technology followed the same pattern. Big email groups eventually broke into small email groups. Usenet, a technology that aimed to solve the limitations of the BBS, went from a set of large channels into an impossible to track number of small channels.

The message board, which made it easier for the tens of millions of new internet users to be herded into communities online quickly followed the same pattern. The big forum for sports soon broke into forums for specific sports and then forums for specific teams and then rival tribes within the team fanbase. The main driver was always the inability of any group of people larger than the Dunbar number to interact with one another inside an internet community without conflict.

We are now seeing another round of this with microblogging. After the election, the doxers, deviants and lunatics that came to dominate Twitter in the pre-Musk age have jumped ship to something called Bluesky. They have all sorts of reasons ranging from technological to conspiratorial, but the main reason is they cannot face the reality of their moral turpitude, so they are seeking shelter among the like-minded, in a similar way described in the study, When Prophecy Fails.

In one of life’s amusing ironies, they can thank Andrew Torba for the opportunity to create their own fever swamp. The tireless efforts by Torba to keep Gab going, despite the relentless attacks by the crazies, was the first step in the disaggregation phase of the modern social media platform. Gab became a fun refuge for those excluded from Twitter, something like Alfred’s fort at Athelney, from which he waged his heroic resistance to the great heathen army.

Gab surviving and thriving in its inimical way was a proof of concept that opened the door to the coming disaggregation. Mastodon and now Bluesky are hoping to attract niche communities that seek an alternative to Musk’s Twitter. The people into “right wing” conspiracy theories first tried mastodon, but found it too challenging, so they have landed on Bluesky, which is easier for them to navigate. They can now share their conspiracy theories in a “safe” environment.

Twitter will remain the dominant player, owing to the fact it is owned by Musk, and he is besties with the new president. Advertisers are returning to the platform, so it will probably start to turn a profit or at least break even. The ascendent economic interests want one central platform, so they will support it, but those forces of disaggregation will keep gnawing away at it. Nature, at least human nature, does not like centralization, at least not the reality of it, so disaggregation always prevails.

That is the engine of history. Whether it is family dynasties, empires, authoritarian regimes or the unipolar world order, the desire to centralize and control always crashes into the rocks of disaggregation. The tribal nature of man, evolved over millions of years, has not been completely beaten out of after ten thousand years of civilization, so conflict and separation are baked in the cake of human organization. Separation, peaceful or violent, is always the end of the story.


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Comments (Historical)

The comments below were originally posted to thezman.com.

115 Comments

David Wright #432852 November 14, 2024 8:38 am 37
I took a quick look at Bluesky and yep, all the crazy escapees seeking asylum from X are there. One comment stands out; this place is like therapy. Of course Don Lemon made his grand entrance there. For him it’s better to rule in hell then serve in heaven.
Marko #432866 November 14, 2024 9:35 am 13
Always remember, if the name ends in “i”, it’s gentile. If it ends in “y”….
David Wright #432873 November 14, 2024 9:56 am 14
Funny but true. Reminds me of my brother telling a story about him and his future wife renting a hall for wedding. Wife was of Ukranian heritage and last name ended in wicz. Rental guy asked her how to spell it correctly for forms. Later her mother stepped in strong arming him on price and as he was writing he asked if she was sure it wasn’t witz referencing an earlier discussion about the difference of jewish designation.
Ostei Kozelskii #432889 November 14, 2024 11:12 am 18
Sounds like the poor bastard was at his Witz end…
TempoNick #432936 November 14, 2024 4:17 pm -2
It’s a little trickier with off, eff, ev and ov. Runs the gamut.
Brandon Laskow #432945 November 14, 2024 5:02 pm 1
Same with -vich
TempoNick #432947 November 14, 2024 6:04 pm 0
and -vitch – both Jew and gentile use that. Then you can throw another loop in there with Slavicized Islamic names like the Tsarnaev brothers.
Severian #432861 November 14, 2024 9:15 am 21
How does the psychological need to proselytize fit into this? If I start up a BBS to discuss baseball, say, it makes sense that eventually it disaggregates into rival Yankees and Red Sox boards, and then into different groups within those fan bases, as you say. But, crucially, the Red Sox guys are happy, indeed eager, to leave the Yankees guys alone (I know, shitposting is a thing, but in general). I want to say that the “Left” (for rhetorical convenience) simplycan’tdisaggregate. We’d love it if they went off to have their own version of Twitter; hell, we were perfectly happy to let them have theactualTwitter. But they just couldn’t leave it alone, because they can’t leave anything alone. I think this overwhelming compulsion they have to infiltrate and proselytize breaks the analysis down…
thezman #432870 November 14, 2024 9:46 am 29
I was going too long, so I did not touch on this, but I suspect a diving force behind the centralizers is the innate desire to impose their morality on the rest. The people driving desegregation, on the other hand, want to be left alone. It is why the crazies escaping to Bluesky tell each other that the invisible of army of Hitler will soon join them. Not only do they need a devil, they need someone to lecture.
Jack Dobson #432875 November 14, 2024 10:14 am 13
Not only do they need a devil, they need someone to lecture. It is why eventually, some sooner than others, many if not most will return to Twitter. The pleasantness of their absence will be remembered and tolerance for their usual bullshit will be much thinner than in the past. As I suggested earlier this week, Polymarket (if the Regime does not shutter it beforehand) should take bets on how long it is until, say, The Guardian pops back on to preach to the unwashed, all out of the goodness of its heart.
Mycale #432885 November 14, 2024 11:05 am 5
It’s happened once already. There was an exodus of these sorts after Musk bought the platform. They also claimed that Musk’s firings meant that the platform and company would collapse because of all the expertise that he got rid of. They gloated when he brought back a few of them afterwards. As always, this says a lot more about them than it does X.
Jack Dobson #432910 November 14, 2024 12:52 pm 13
Leftists are deranged. I once dismissed the claim that “liberalism is a mental illness.” How stupid of me. That’s hilarious and predictable, by the way. Cucks are already preaching unity and forgiveness. Fuck them right along with the wannabe communists.
Hemid #432911 November 14, 2024 1:01 pm 4
What it says is that censorship is very, very effective.They think the thing they think everybody thinks, and “everybody” is now so constrained—dissenters of all kinds are so thoroughly banned from everywhere—that everything they think is wrong.If you argueon 4chanthat Twitter works about as well as it did before Elon bought it and its financial state is fine or irrelevant, you’re definitely getting dogpiled (onlypartlyby ActBlue botjeets), you’re very likely to have your post deleted, and you’re not unlikely to be banned. The “consensus” of the most right-wing site on the internet is identical to MSNBC—on anything considered important enough to manufacture a consensus about.On Twitter you can say Twitter is doing fine, of course, but what gets you in trouble there? How could you know? Those guys are all banned. They’re not allowed to tell you why—and Elon always pretends he doesn’t know.
Ostei Kozelskii #432891 November 14, 2024 11:17 am 3
In its geopolitical aspect, the desire for wealth, power and status, perhaps moreso than morality, ideology, religion, has been the stimulus for centralization. The Mongols had no interest in imposing the worship of Tengri on the Russians; they just wanted their land and resources.
Severian #432892 November 14, 2024 11:20 am 3
I wonder if Musk knows that, and is waiting for the temper tantrum to die down before he rolls out a much more robust subscription model. I got a good laugh at Don Lemon’s hilariously overwrought and narcissistic “resignation letter,” like everyone else, but I noted that his official reason is “a change in the terms of service,” re: the adjudication of claims. Once they’re gone, he might go full subscription, and so when all the Leftists come crawling back because there are no Deplorables to lecture on Bluesky, he can say “You pays your money, you takes your chances” re: calls for more censorship. I agree that theywillbe back; as pointed out downthread, a bunch of them have already rage-quit Twitter at least once. Maybe Elon’s taking the opportunity to really scalp them this time.
james wilson #432933 November 14, 2024 4:08 pm 4
Our most basic instincts were formed over 150k plus years. Humans have a visceral fear of heights. The monkey does not. Some humans will overcome fear of heights it if the pay is high enough. Most won’t.Hayek claimed atavistik man was, in modern terms, socialist–a solitary man was a dead man. And, that all advances in civilization were anti-instinctual–like trade through intermediaries. Then the advances stick only when they are too benificial to ignore at which point we imagine they are natural.Socialism (centralization) always returns in spite of disatrous examples because it is instinctive, and instinctive is easy. The ruthless rule by boot on neck, the clever and ruthless rule by exploiting the instinct of normie. It’s become a sopisticated push button enterprise which is, at the moment, over its skis. We’ll see.
Apex Predator #432916 November 14, 2024 2:12 pm 17
I think this is accurate because the people we are discussing are very effeminate in the negative sense of the word. Not feminine, the negative energy part of being female. Emotional, volatile, child-like, petulant. They will stomp their feet, scream, and just be overly dramatic running away to a safe space. Then, over time, in childlike fashion they will calm and return to the playground. For a while… until the next outrage cycle.I have seen tremendous self-sorting in the last week or so since Trump re-ascended. Liberal ‘friends’ of mine removing themselves from chat groups because they are so childlike in their inability to regulate emotion they cannot handle any contrary opinion or information. These are grown ass men in many cases, and I know a shockingly high amount of them. And the wives are FAR worse which likely explains much.I’ve said this before but I never realized how powerful long term and subtle propaganda is at capturing the midwit and the average mind. I use to be baffled by the Soviet times and the Pravda mindset but no longer. Some of these people I have known for decades and there is almost no part of their former selves remaining. They are SO far to the left and like a swimmer in the ocean who thinks he is simply treading water to remain ‘in place’ this powerful current has carried them far far away from their starting position.
Ostei Kozelskii #432924 November 14, 2024 3:19 pm 4
Alas, that same current also captured the conservatives.
3g4me #432940 November 14, 2024 4:33 pm 8
My husband was mocking an online headline last night – “Trump’s Sec Defense nominee doesn’t believe women belong in combat!!!” it shrieked. Until people can openly say (and accept in their hearts and minds as true) that men and women and races are different – physically, psychologically, and intellectually – then everything is built on a foundation of lies and NOTHING will change. You can be a mega magatard on X, but you can’t say only Whites can be Americans.
Compsci #432975 November 15, 2024 9:48 am 1
Perfect summary of the problem and the 30,000 foot view needed to guide the novice.
Filthie #432869 November 14, 2024 9:44 am 18
I never heard of it.Never had a Twitter account either. But I am a grumpy fat old white guy that hates everyone on general principle. I’m all over Blab for the rude jokes and realistic commentary. Given my politics even the loons there are entertaining and if they’re not I am an adult with a ‘mute’ button.I did a cursory fly-by of Bluesky and immediately recognized it for a faggot/femcnut enclave and left. I don’t think it will survive long or ever be a force in our social space. I note with some cheer that similar lefty social spaces like CNN and MSNBC are going to be laying off and restructuring as these tectonic shifts in politics continues. The rebellion against wokeness has begun. There will be refugees as their old places become rubble.I am okay with them having their own spaces. I’d rather not share mine with them and anything that gets them away from me is a Good Thing…
Marko #432856 November 14, 2024 8:56 am 18
話說天下大勢. 分久必合,合久必分 The empire, long divided, must unite; long united, must divide. Thus it has ever been. Romance of the Three Kingdoms, 14th c.
N.S. Palmer #432862 November 14, 2024 9:20 am 3
很有意思!谢谢!
Marko #432867 November 14, 2024 9:37 am 1
Bu keqi
Zaphod #432868 November 14, 2024 9:42 am 2
Damn! Beat me to it!
Zaphod #432871 November 14, 2024 9:50 am 2
Now that I think of it, Sulla Aficionados might want to investigate a certain Cao Cao.
KGB #432878 November 14, 2024 10:27 am 1
說得有道理!
Alzaebo #432934 November 14, 2024 4:10 pm 1
Sigh. It’s all Greek to me.
Kralizec #432954 November 14, 2024 8:52 pm 2
I think you mean “Gleek”
Pets need parameters #432886 November 14, 2024 11:05 am 12
The need to belong, to be accepted and liked/approved of is strong, whether a mean girls high school clique or a presidential cabinet, or even here on this website. There are very few outliers willing to walk alone.
Ostei Kozelskii #432893 November 14, 2024 11:25 am 5
Yes. Thymotic pride. The desire to be esteemed by one’s fellow man or dame. Undoubtedly a key aspect of what we call human nature.
Alzaebo #432928 November 14, 2024 3:36 pm 2
That vocabulary! Below, milord is compared favorably to a troll; I say no, that milord is a Jester of astonishing literacy.(Sans the belled cap, a man doth have his pride.)Rather than a key aspect, I say such desire is the arboreal essence of our kind. We had not fearsome fangs nor claws, but instead, each other.As a Prey species, like herbivores, our greatest fantasy is to unite against some awesome Predator.Our fur is smooth that we might dive into the waters of Miocenene swamps to escape, our brachiatial build is that we may climb the tree instead.We are Prey become Predator, the Herd-who-Hunts.Our bull rings protect the core of females and calves, our outlier packs range seeking mating rights. Eventually, the yipping of those outlier packs join into a chorus, loud enough to contest the aging bull ring.As the old bulls are pushed off the hill, the united packs become the new ring, their howls identifying the different generation. The remnants of the old bulls mill about as outlier packs, their children increasingly loud, dreaming someday of reclaiming the glorious past that was theirs.
Ostei Kozelskii #432935 November 14, 2024 4:14 pm 0
Saaaaaaay…you’ve been reading Clan of the Cave Bear. Or mebbe you wrote it.
mmack #432872 November 14, 2024 9:54 am 11
A couple of thoughts: Centralization and Decentralization, thus as it ever was:Or as David Byrne would sing: “SAME! AS! IT! EVER! WAS!”. And then slap himself in the forehead.In the disaggregated world, there are those who see a benefit, personally, morally or philosophically in bringing the disparate parts under one roof. At some point in the consolidation process, there are those who begin to see a benefit, personally, morally or philosophically in breaking the blob into pieces or creating alternative pieces to the blob.Speaking of business, as in, we make real, tangible things here for our customers, in light of the Scandemic breaking “Just in Time” supply chains will we see a return to Vertical Integration in manufacturing? I think of Henry Ford’s River Rouge plant when it opened, where Ford mined the ore, smelted the steel and iron, and aimed to control everything it took to make a Model A and later cars from bumper to bumper, tire to roof.I know, I should post something on the centralization/decentralization of the internet. All I can think of is Facebook is a huge “thing” that when you ask people about it, apparently no one “goes there” anymore. Cue Yogi Berra, eh?
Alzaebo #432927 November 14, 2024 3:29 pm 1
Wow. I didn’t know that about Ford.Those Industrial Age barons were true Titans. plus, that cartoon…one for the ages
mmack #432948 November 14, 2024 6:41 pm 0
There’s a pretty good video on YouTube from the late 1930’s of the River Rouge plant that follows the process of building Fords from the ore carriers docking by the plant all the way to the cars rolling completed off the line: https://youtu.be/bnb7zXicXsc?si=TOqt9V6WPhxbf89g Ford tried to make everything but the tires, and he tried (and failed) to grow rubber trees in a Ford owned plantation in Brazil.
TomA #432876 November 14, 2024 10:19 am 6
Why does this dynamic exist? Because it works, in the evolutionary sense. Whenever an assembly of human beings gets gets comfortable and stale as a result of high societal efficiency (borne of centralized productivity), that affluence leads to a decline in robustness due to the absence of hardship and culling. This decline eventually leads to a fracturing into weak and strong communities, with the latter prevailing. Business cycle.
Templar #432849 November 14, 2024 8:29 am 5
Hell of it is Usenet is still around. So is IRC. Fun times back then, though.
Trek #432851 November 14, 2024 8:37 am 16
One good thing back in those days was you needed a minimum IQ to participate. You had to understand something about the technology. That acted as a barrier to entry against really stupid people.
Compsci #432881 November 14, 2024 10:40 am 2
Yep, but even in those days with those types, we saw all/most of the problems we see today with personal—but anonymous—interaction between individuals. I still remember my first encounter with a troll, who read the exchanges unceasingly looking for posters to bully and insult. The topic of discussion was irrelevant for him, only that an aggressive insulting comment could be interjected. Got me memorialized by the Electronic Freedom Foundation who always took an unwavering stance supporting such folk and unlimited (disruptive) commentary. Last I looked, I was on their list of “bad people”. It was badge of honor.
Tars Tarkas #432890 November 14, 2024 11:14 am 4
Trolls are a thousand times better than true believers. Trolls just want to have fun. Like you said, the topic is absolutely irrelevant to the Troll. They are not emotionally committed. Today, the term Troll is completely abused. A Troll is now anyone who disagrees with you.
Compsci #432900 November 14, 2024 11:49 am 3
I agree. My definition of “troll” might not be everyone else’s. In this case, he was not amusing. Ostei is amusing and fun to read—but he is no troll. This person was disruptive to any flow of exchange, and deliberately so. He’d stop the flow of meaningful exchange, hurt feelings, shut people up, then move on.
Eloi #432909 November 14, 2024 12:51 pm 4
I have to nominate myself as a longstanding troll, in the true sense. I enjoy hijacking and riling up threads on Twitter for the sole purpose of making people irate. I never get worked up over the matter.Here is why you should pay the troll’s toll: A troll is your chance, if you think, to recognize that all online is fake and g@y, and the troll relishes in exploiting this incongruity to cause amusement for those who understand and anger in those who are too vested in the beast.So sayeth the Troll.
Alzaebo #432919 November 14, 2024 3:04 pm 2
If you’re that punk who ruined the latest Simplicius, then go fuck yourself. A troll is as bad as some African who shits in the airport lobby and then thinks himself superior.
Eloi #432920 November 14, 2024 3:06 pm 2
I don’t know what you are talking about. I troll under the same name. I don’t post on Simplicius (I read him).And, go jack off, for you clearly have a sperm-retention anger, and clearly no woman wants you.
Compsci #432944 November 14, 2024 4:48 pm 0
I gave you an upvote for honesty, but I can’t agree with you and your praise of trolling. And honestly, do you claim to troll as your example above here in this group? I’d certainly remember such, but don’t.
Tars Tarkas #432946 November 14, 2024 5:08 pm 0
Trolling, when done well, is hilarious to everyone except the people being trolled (who usually don’t even know they are being trolled).The thing is, it’s not easy to do trolling well so they just come off as asshats, their trolling clumsy and obvious and so they are just ignored.
TempoNick #432938 November 14, 2024 4:27 pm 0
Ditto here, at least back in the old days. I looked at it as the perfect vehicle to get the instinct to get a rise out of people out of my system. That way, I can be nice and normal in real life. 😁 Since I host the page I run, I try to play it relatively even handed, though what I really think does come out. The funny thing is when people try to troll me and I just laugh at them. You can’t troll a troll.
Gortz vB. #432929 November 14, 2024 3:45 pm 0
That’s why I could never catch on to Discord for Dummies.
Tars Tarkas #432888 November 14, 2024 11:10 am 4
The great thing about usenet was that the sissies couldn’t ban you when you made a fool of them. No way to get rid of wrong-think either. When I was on Earthlink, which was up until about 2017, they were still carrying usenet and the binary groups. I got tons and tons of music, movies and books from them. But my phone company forced fiber optic to my house and DSL is incompatible with it.
Bilejones #432902 November 14, 2024 12:06 pm 4
it was DEC with their Vax370 that started to chip away at the mainframes, It had about the computing power of the average washing machine.
Compsci #432932 November 14, 2024 4:06 pm 3
Then came along Sun Microsystems and sold you a $20k Unix desktop that had less computing power than your typical cell phone. 😉
Pozymandias #433179 November 16, 2024 4:59 pm 0
It’s amazing how much those things cost for what they did. Then again, the companies that made them knew they were selling to businesses and not consumers so the customer had infinity monies. There’s a YouTube channel that has a video showing what a quarter million dollar SGI was like in 1993 –https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bo3lUw9GUJA. I had a job in the late 90s where one of the machines I used was a low-end SGI with 8-bit graphics. It would use that stippling technique to represent shadows and colors outside the palette. Everything looked sore of like color comics in the newspaper under a magnifying glass.
Compsci #432879 November 14, 2024 10:30 am 4
We see something similar wrt a new phenomenon, the “independent researcher” in HBD science, specifically wrt genetic explanations of IQ and behavioral attributes. The University research system no longer allows such explorations among faculty and the number of journals that will touch/review such papers—much less publish them—are vanishingly small and cannot keep up with demand and time constraints of journal publication as the field expands.Most of my readings are via direct subscription to these researchers. Some charge for such subscription, some do not. The difference between what I receive via the quarterly journal subscription route and now is simply one of cost and frequency of publication. When at university, I had no cost for journals, but was locked into their selection—and therefore research topic choices.I think it’s better now.
Alzaebo #432925 November 14, 2024 3:21 pm 4
I saw a article that said Robert Maxwell, Ghislaine’s infamous father, was the one responsible for installing the peer review system and its awfulness. Apparently he bought up and published the professional journals with the intent of consolidating them under his wretched grip, just as he bought up the high-school textbook publishers that gave us our faux history. Following that, one of the Covid doctors says it is PubMed that monitors and suppresses the necessary and contrarian studies in the medical field.
Compsci #432941 November 14, 2024 4:35 pm 1
The school textbook market k-12, and university is the largest segment of publication industry. It exceeds everything else combined…fiction, nonfiction, health, exercise, how-to, etc. everything! That’s one of the reasons why the publisher’s are such whores to local and State school boards and are happy to adjust their publication content accordingly.
Alan Schmidt #432865 November 14, 2024 9:32 am 4
Urbit fills the niche of forcing someone to have reasonable IQ to be able to communicate due to its relatively complex ramp-up effort. Some of the irritable old-school guys in our sphere went there after they got sick of the idiots on both sides.
pyrrhus #432864 November 14, 2024 9:25 am 4
Generally, aggregation favors a narrow class of oligarchs, who are always trying to expand their wealth and influence…As Dr. Johnson said about a possible union of the UK and the American colonies, “we should unite with you only to rob you…”
Hemid #432913 November 14, 2024 1:31 pm 1
Aggregation via apparent disaggregation would be ideal from the oligarchs’ perspective. Resistance would become incomprehensible. It would always be understood as resistance to something definitionally different, towhatever. Like to “Our Democracy.”If I were them I’d propagandize differently, maybe with an absurd, self-contradictory, literally unthinkable concept like “counter-elite.” People whothinkthey think that will follow any order. Hell, they’ll continuallyanticipate, in every sense, their submission.Maybe I’d put on a great show—the greatest, they tell me!—post the great mythicalproof.mov. It’s not like there’s a budget limit, and if it works, maybe it works forever.Any of ourHegel guysbeen noticing anything like that happening? Do we still have Hegel guys? Haven’t heard from any lately. Did they change jobs?
Zaphod #432950 November 14, 2024 6:55 pm 0
Ah Hegel you say? The Chinese just accepted the aggregation/disaggregation cycle as a natural tide go in / tide go out aspect of the human condition and indeed the wider universe. Top of his game Whitey thought he’d be smart and write down the recipe and throw in a sack of teleological seasoning and a hogshead of blood. Quite the witches’ brew.
Zaphod #432949 November 14, 2024 6:46 pm 0
That’s interesting. He must have learned at least one thing from Boswell’s jabberings.
Hi-ya #432857 November 14, 2024 9:09 am 4
I post on gabs nature subs, but otherwise it’s really boring. Telegrams is too much of a firehose of info for me, so I’m not really doing these message boards anymore. im going out in the woods today tho!
Spingerah #432897 November 14, 2024 11:38 am 2
Come April, I’ll have my replacement up & running on.his own. I’m popping smoke & going to grow pumpkins be a dental floss tycoon
Mycale #432854 November 14, 2024 8:47 am 4
I thought this is why Metaberg made Threads. That went nowhere. But it also seems now that Zuck took up BJJ and found his balls, he’s not interested in that role anymore.
pyrrhus #432863 November 14, 2024 9:21 am 3
Jiu jitsu can be obsessive…I’ve been there! That’s when many of us started following Joe Rogan….
Ed #432926 November 14, 2024 3:22 pm 3
Torba doesn’t get nearly enough credit for his work with Gab, and the his concept of parallel economies will hopefully take hold some day so our dollars can be kept away from the majority of moneychangers.
Dutchboy #432896 November 14, 2024 11:36 am 3
I glance at X occasionally but find it mostly thin gruel. For me, social media is a way to share family pics and news with my widely scattered siblings and their offspring (refugees from California) and get some laughs from memes and organizations that interest me (e.g., army veterans). I mostly ignore any political stuff, esp. from my relatives who are mostly Christian Zionist nutjobs. It’s a pity, because they are otherwise nice people.
Known Fact #432955 November 14, 2024 8:57 pm 2
If you follow or cover business news you see this cycle play out all the time — Businesses centralize operations to become “more efficient” and then decentralize to become “more nimble.” Rinse and repeat
Christopher Chantrill #432914 November 14, 2024 1:32 pm 2
Yep. Most of the time the natural instinct of humans is to protect themselves against change. Only after disaster strikes is there an opportunity to build without fighting the regulators and the NIMBYs. E.g., Germany and Japan after WWII.
Compsci #432931 November 14, 2024 4:04 pm 0
Nothing was more apparent than when I was in Germany as a teenager. Bombing your older, inner city, flat does wonders for rebuilding a modern designed city center. 😉
Zulu Juliet #432905 November 14, 2024 12:20 pm 2
O/T, but tangential, listening to some techno-pop on Pandora this morning, a voice-over played above the drum machines and synthesizers:“There’s messages in every game. Like Pac-Man. Do you know what “Pac” stands for? P-A-C: program and control. He’s Program and Control Man. The whole thing’s a metaphor. He thinks he’s got free will, but really he’s trapped in a maze, in a system. All he can do is consume, he’s pursued by demons that are probably just in his own head and even if he does manage to escape by slipping out one side of the maze, what happens? He comes right back in the other side. People think it’s a happy game. It’s not a happy game, it’s a f**king nightmare world and the worst thing is, it’s real and we live in it. It’s all code. If you listen closely, you can hear the numbers. There’s a cosmic flowchart that dictates where you can and where you can’t go. I’ve given you the knowledge. I’ve set you free. Do you understand?”
Pozymandias #433198 November 17, 2024 2:23 pm 0
You know things are bad when an honest description of society sounds like a ranting schizophrenic. I’ve always chuckled at that old joke – just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they’re not out to get you!
Tom K #432895 November 14, 2024 11:30 am 2
“Lincoln’s call for volunteers to suppress the ‘rebellion’ of the Cotton States caused the secession of the Upper South. The Cotton States felt that the federal government violated their agreement, and the Upper South believed that they had every right to leave, even if the Upper South disagreed with their reasons for leaving. As R. L. Dabney explained, ‘However wrongfully any State might resume its Independence without just cause, the only remedy was conciliation, and not force, that therefore the coercion of a sovereign State was unlawful, mischievous, and must be resisted. There Virginia took her stand.’”https://identitydixie.com/2024/11/14/part-1-causes-of-southern-secession-in-the-upper-south/As Jeb Smith explains in the article, many in the North were sympathetic to Southern secession until it became clear that the removal of the revenue generated from the excise taxes imposed on the South would strip the Northern government of much of its revenue.The four upper South states of Virginia, North Carolina, Tennessee and Arkansas joined the Cotton states motivated primarily by the rights of sovereign states in the original compact, not slavery.They were also bound by ties of heritage and a common culture, it goes without saying.Fortunately slavery is no longer an issue so advantage “right.” I think the permanent lesson we learned from that catastrophe is that any secession today (except perhaps within individual states) would compound the harm, by leaving us without any representation in Congress, thus leaving us at the mercies of the fanatics who would remain (Not that that’s a real threat any longer.) We have no choice but to fight to gain control of the U.S. government and reform it from within however unrewarding that may sometimes appear. Right now we have gained temporary dominance but there is a long battle of perhaps decades ahead. If kinetic war ever did breaks out again it would be a true civil war, not a war between sections of the country.The Old South was naive to leave their seats in Congress unoccupied thus ceding control of the US government to the North. We’re all in this together now in the fight against radical egalitarianism and open borders.
Tom K #432921 November 14, 2024 3:08 pm 0
I noticed earlier I got some downvotes but now it’s back to even. I have gone over what I wrote and the only thing I would change is in second paragraph from bottom I would substitute “resurgence” for “dominance.” It’s hard to know what I wrote that was so offensive when no one actually criticizes my comment. I suspect it’s because I wrote that the Old South was “naive” to leave their seats in Congress. But if you can’t critique your own mistakes then you can’t make any improvement in your game. I could have used a different word: arrogance.
Alzaebo #432922 November 14, 2024 3:09 pm 0
Talk about an aggregation-disaggregation cycle!In spades, like the difference between medieval kings and imperial monarchs.
Compsci #432939 November 14, 2024 4:29 pm 0
“If kinetic war ever did breaks out again it would be a true civil war, not a war between sections of the country.”The war stops when the war stops. The CW war was between two sides, one wanted to leave, the other did not want that. If the South had battled the North to a potential Northern loss territorially (and it did kill twice as many Northerners), or even a prolonged boring stalemate, and the North said enough, let’s talk. Why would it not have stopped with some compromise and a de facto two country partition?Similarly, a new CW might have the same dynamics. Both sides will tire enough to come to some compromise. Fighting to the death seems not in the cards. For a modern example, see Ukraine. I doubt Russia is going to continue to spend more resources taking over the non-Russian parts of Ukraine unless forced to. Similarly, a modern CW need not be a death match—one or the other. Both sides “might” exhaust themselves and settle. It is an imbalance between the two that will cause extended conflict when/if one side feels it will prevail at an acceptable cost.
Vizzini #432880 November 14, 2024 10:31 am 2
Kamala helpfully explains cloud computing: https://youtu.be/liL2VXYNyus?si=ueUxn0W3l0pkTMC4
Brandon Laskow #432942 November 14, 2024 4:39 pm 4
That this bimbo and airhead was actually a major party candidate for the most powerful position in the country was the ultimate troll job.
Pozymandias #433180 November 16, 2024 5:13 pm 0
She seems off her game there. Maybe she didn’t get enough “Irish” in her coffee that morning.
N.S. Palmer #432858 November 14, 2024 9:11 am 2
A terrific analysis! I’ve witnessed a lot of the events. When I first worked in DC in the 1980s, PCs and then BBSs were just getting started. Most federal departments had at least one PC enthusiast who set up a BBS with all the department’s information. If you had the BBS phone number and were a reporter (as I was) or a spy, you could discover a lot. Online interactions were also a lot more civilized; we might try going back to some form of that: https://the-1000-year-view.com/2019/03/06/a-retro-idea-to-improve-the-net/
M. Murcek #433130 November 15, 2024 7:36 pm 1
Twitter was a heavily censored progressive echo chamber. Twitter is gone. The platform is called X. Deal with it.
TempoNick #432917 November 14, 2024 2:29 pm 1
I run a group on Facebook for a niche hobby, 28,000 members, which ain’t bad for a niche. We have the most or second most members of the couple dozen groups and pages in that genre. I have no idea how engaged those 28,000 are or what that means, but it’s far more than I ever expected when I started the page.I started my group for the same reason I get amused by all the downvotes I often get when I post something here. I got tired of having my posts censored, deleted and getting kicked off of boards. I figured, if nothing else, I’d have my own soapbox and nobody will tell me what I can and can’t post.Turns out, a lot of like minds appreciate the same thing and congregate together. More people appreciate a little edge than pablum dictated by snowflakes. We have a lot less argument there than many other groups/pages, as well.
Compsci #432930 November 14, 2024 4:01 pm 4
The problem I found with FB before I left was that any particular group I was in exceeded 40-50k easily and as such, impossible to read all postings/commentary and there were a lot—not unusual to find 1.6k comments or more. Most postings/comments however were of the “me too” type and added nothing very informative to the discussion. I soon unsubscribed to FB and found I was better off in smaller venues where there was more back and forth commentary from a smaller, but perhaps more focused group.
The Tribal Nature of Humanity The ConsolidationDisaggregation Cycle #432915 November 14, 2024 2:05 pm 1
[…] Source:https://thezman.com/wordpress/?p=33026[…]
Dave Davenport #432957 November 14, 2024 9:06 pm 0
“Nature, at least human nature, does not like centralization, at least not the reality of it, so disaggregation always prevails.” What does that imply about the future of the Russian Federation and Ukraine?
thezman #432958 November 15, 2024 6:54 am 0
Nothing. The current makeup of Russia is its natural state.
David Davenport #433132 November 15, 2024 8:23 pm 0
“The current makeup of Russia is its natural state.” You’re not answering my question.
Hokkoda #432956 November 14, 2024 9:02 pm 0
Maybe we can start the new year by disaggregating the FBI…
Dan Doffs #432853 November 14, 2024 8:45 am -11
“A recurring dynamic within the ongoing technological revolution is the process in which the forces of centralization sweep up the various nodes within a particular area into a dominant organization or industry.” Geez Z that’s some world class word salad there — worthy of any HR. 🙂
Hoagie #432855 November 14, 2024 8:49 am 13
This is another one of your posts that I have no idea what you’re talking about. This happens about three or four times a year. Well, there’s always Monday.
ray #432883 November 14, 2024 10:59 am 4
Thank God, somebody else doesn’t know what the hell this thread is about. Thought it was just me. I did understand the dood who said he was going out into the woods today, though. :O)
Mr C #432859 November 14, 2024 9:11 am 10
Words have exact meaning. That was a cogent statement and the opposite of “word salad.”
sahtchel #432912 November 14, 2024 1:24 pm 5
If you skim through that sentence, it may seem like a word salad, but upon reading it more carefully, it makes perfect sense. Things like Harris’ actual word salads are crude pantomimes of sentences like Z’s that the stupid employ.
Zaphod #432953 November 14, 2024 7:05 pm 0
If you scroll up, it’s much pithier in Chinese. So get on your bike and start learning.
Greg Nikolic #432860 November 14, 2024 9:13 am -28
Although societies break apart and splinter from one another, there is always a centrifugal force whipping them together. People are nosy and curious. Mega-cities form as entertainment hubs develop. The urge to have fun defeats the urge to be left alone. Even in the South, a region known for its spread-out isolationism, there are mega-cities like Atlanta and Houston to cater to decadent cosmopolitan tastes. Expect to see smaller towns in the South empty out as the metropolises swell in size. In the end, as much as they hate to admit it, people like people, and will pay top dollar to live in desirable places like Greenwich village, New York; San Francisco; and Austin, Texas. These places are the glue in a crumbly society.— Greg (my blog:http://www.dark.sport.blog)
ProZNoV #432874 November 14, 2024 10:13 am 12
They may be the “glue” that drive civilization, but they’re also it’s ultimate doom. Most succinct explanation is Spandrell’s concept of cities being “IQ shredders.” A more ancient account would be the Biblical story of the Tower of Babel. “Rural” today doesn’t really mean farming anyway. You can enjoy 90% of the amusements living in the countryside as you can behind your home’s iron barred windows in Houston or Atlanta.
Bartleby the Scrivner #432877 November 14, 2024 10:23 am 15
“The urge to have fun defeats the urge to be left alone”.”people like people”.As a fellow grumpy old man (hat tip to Filthie), I can say with confidence that those two statements apply to young, and inexperienced people.One of my adult daughters moved into the city in 2010. She had a beautiful apartment, worked a block from her home. All was good, until it wasn’t. We laugh about it now, as she says “what was I thinking”.The truth is, she didn’t know any better. As for hubs that cater to “decadent cosmopolitan tastes”, well, I think that says it all.Oh, and I hate people. My pecking order isThe kidsThe dogsMy Wife(she gets it)The rest of the livestock
3g4me #432884 November 14, 2024 11:00 am 13
Bartleby: I’ve been fortunate enough to visit many beautiful (and not so beautiful) cities around the world. And I’m grateful I was able to do so while -even though they weren’t all at their prime – they were still far more organic and innate than they are today. There are still places I wish I could have seen but will now never do so (having to fly, immivaders, etc.). But far more than people, I now value natural beauty and quieter places.Crowds and public spaces are not safe for White people. And people are vastly overrated.
james wilson #432937 November 14, 2024 4:23 pm 0
I’ll soon be crossing the Atlantic for the first time, for eight days wondering through Scotland. I turned down the option of walking London for a day or two. My loss but I missed it by thirty years or more.
3g4me #432952 November 14, 2024 6:58 pm 0
I’veread that there are, unfortunately, plenty of rapefugees up in Scotland now (none when I was there in the ’80s). But I found the people hearty and friendly, and old Edinburgh and the royal Mile is magical. I clambered up Arthur’s Seat (an extinct volcano) one sunny afternoon with a book and some snacks and just read and thought and imagined. A favourite memory.
Compsci #432882 November 14, 2024 10:45 am 15
Speaking of alternative platforms…Greg’s still pimping his unread blog here. Some people never learn.
ray #432887 November 14, 2024 11:06 am 13
‘In the end, as much as they hate to admit it, people like people, and will pay top dollar to live in desirable places like Greenwich village, New York; San Francisco; and Austin, Texas.’ OK then well, I guess it’s true I am Your Favorite Martian. I avoid those type places like leprosy. A buddy or two generally is all I can tolerate re: humanity. Ps Greg Nikolic if you stop advertising your website they’ll stop downvoting you. I think. Maybe. You are welcome.
Ostei Kozelskii #432894 November 14, 2024 11:30 am 8
Indeed. You’d have to quintuple my earnings to get me to even think about moving to Austin. I’d rather live out in the sticks with the horny toads, cicada killers, rattlesnakes and polecats than with the lumpenleft, pervs and nuggras.
Tom K #432898 November 14, 2024 11:40 am 6
I have fond memories of Austin. That was fifty years ago. I wouldn’t go back there now even for a visit.
Alzaebo #432918 November 14, 2024 2:54 pm 0
Surprisingly, I did come upon a herd of the white deer of Austin, considered by most to be a local myth. On a state highway, about 2 a.m., well outside the city limits.
3g4me #432899 November 14, 2024 11:46 am 11
I visited NY city twice – and I absolutely hated it. The people, the noise, the filth. Visited San Francisco briefly on the way back from Asia and was not impressed. Vienna was a gem 35 years ago. Same with Budapest and Prague. Loved the history in London but not the people it was filling with. Loved Edinburgh. Wish I could have seen Copenhagen. Hong Kong was a nightmare. I’d like to see Alaska but you couldn’t drag me onto a cruise ship. I’m content in the woods and the hills.
ray #432906 November 14, 2024 12:26 pm 9
Best years of my life were isolated in a cabin in east WA state up near the canadian border. Pnut the Squirrel, grand firs and pines for company. Little crick nearby, happily burbling like a newborn babe, dotted with snow in winters. As close to heaven as this planet gets.
Tom K #432923 November 14, 2024 3:13 pm 3
NYC was the industrial age’s vision of a perfect city built solely for efficiency and profit. Actually it was a perfect nightmare.
Compsci #432901 November 14, 2024 11:57 am 2
I’m not a “people person”, but love when in the “big city” to walk about in the crowds. It’s just so different from my norm and reminiscent of when I was young and growing up.
Ostei Kozelskii #432904 November 14, 2024 12:15 pm 7
Alas, the “crowds” ain’t quite what they used to be in NYC back in the 60s. But I get what you’re saying. When you’re in a good crowd where there’s a sense of ease and shared goodwill, it can be an invigorating even exhilarating experience, particularly in chilly weather. I’m afraid such experiences are now almost nonexistent in AINO, unfortunately.
ray #432907 November 14, 2024 12:29 pm 3
… and then you fled. Right?
Compsci #432943 November 14, 2024 4:42 pm 1
Of course. I go and look over the old neighborhood, hit the mass transport to the museums, Times Square and such. When I’ve had my fill of crowds and ambiance, leave like a good tourist. I was there shortly after 9/11 last. Visited the Trade Tower cleanup. Aside from the interesting mass transport electronic tolls, little had changed for me. In the daytime, there are still White people around. At night, one is careful where one walks.
Zfan #432903 November 14, 2024 12:09 pm 12
I was blessed when younger to live four years in a major Italian city, and several months each in a couple of scenic smaller cities, before the barbarian invasion. For work and family reasons I got to spend some time in other European and Middle Eastern cities. Got to live in Austin and Los Angeles, too. I love big cities that are both organic and authentically native. For example a McDonald’s in Rome or Paris is disgusting as are cosmopolitans in Austin that think themselves better than the local country people and scorn the local accent. Roma autentica, Paris vraie, and authentically Texan Austin are great places to visit and live.All told I prefer the countryside, especially now that I have a much lower income. I can build a fence, cut firewood, plant an orchard and go to church alongside folks with a fortune or next to nothing. They may think it’s interesting that I speak other languages or rubbed shoulders with famous names, but what matters is that I take care of business and treat people decently. I feel the same about them— they are my peopleI will probably never get back to my old places, so I do my best where I am and hope for the best for those other places and peoples I love and admire.I’m pretty fond of ZMan and you commenters, too! That’s my take today on Centralization/decentralization. Keep up commenting- I look forward to them every day. Now, back to turning the compost pile
ray #432908 November 14, 2024 12:31 pm 8
‘I can build a fence, cut firewood, plant an orchard and go to church alongside folks with a fortune or next to nothing.’ Delightful. Cheers.
Pozymandias #433183 November 16, 2024 5:44 pm 0
“Greenwich village, New York; San Francisco; and Austin, Texas” Sorry, I’m not Jewish, gay, or a gay Jewish Country music songwriter.


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